Not that I care for Oprah at all, but she does make some good points.  For whatever reason last night my wife was watching the show, and they showed a clip of a guy saying his kids have no opportunities in America because they won't become "rappers", and thats the only way they will get "rich".

 

 

Until the mindset of the students - and parents - are changed, there is nothing that teachers can do to make the students learn.  Perhaps it is the fact that eduction is free that makes them value you ti cheaply.  WHile many immigrants see it as a valued commodity.

If elementary education wasn't free they would complain about it and say they couldn't get ahead because they can't afford it... yet it's free now and the truth is they just don't use it.

I agree that it's a societal thing in the U.S. It seems that many don't want to study hard to have anything. They want to win the lottery, become a rap star or a become a professional athlete even though the odds of any of those things happening are infintesimal. Though I agree that there are some students who do want to succeed, they don't want to stand out because for some reasons at many schools this isn't "cool". My high school must have been the exception because the popular kids were the kids who did well in school.

I think everything comes back to that "entitlement" society we've built up for ourselves. We pile ourselves in debt because we deserve a nice house right away, an Escalade, that month-long European vacation, etc., etc., and we also deserve to be in school. And if my kid is in school and my kid doesn't learn anything, its the teacher's fault, not my kids. Even if my kid doesn't do his homework or do his work in school, he's there, dammit, and he DESERVES his education, and he should be number one in his class. How does he stack up, by the way? If you were to rank the kids in his first grade class, where would he be?

Ugh. Maybe if it were a privilege to go to school instead of a right, and if kids who would rather stay home and play video games all day (past a certain point), or would rather listen to those ipods all day got to stay home and do that and the kids who chose poor behavior got booted out of school, and the kids who CHOSE their educations got to continue, it would be a much different country. We wouldn't "need" illegal immigrants to do our unskilled labor for us because those kids who chose the video games or ipods would eventually need a job and wouldn't have anything else to do so they'd be pumping gas or digging ditches, and the kids who went to school would be the contractors and the accountants.

Maybe if it were a privilege to go to school instead of a right, and if kids who would rather stay home and play video games all day (past a certain point), or would rather listen to those ipods all day got to stay home and do that and the kids who chose poor behavior got booted out of school,

hahahaha.

I don't think that would work Marcie.  Kids by definition don't "get" how important school is to their future.  My 11 year old is just starting to really grasp the difference between someone who goes to college, and someone who doesn't.  (though college is no guarantee of success)

He'd MUCH rather stay home and play video games, and skate board, stuff like that.  But as his parent I don't allow it because I DO "get" how important education is, especially now.

I think Oprah makes a valid point but I certainly don't have any answers on how to make kids appreciate school.  Frankly, I don't care if my kids appreciate it.  They're doing it.

I think everything comes back to that "entitlement" society we've built up for ourselves.

Absolutely. if it isn't easy, lucrative, and immediate... they beleive they shouldn't bother trying.

Tova~

That is why I said "past a certain point". Kids would have to finish through say...ninth grade or something, but then it would be up to them to choose, and then of course there could be fine parents like yourself who actually care about their kids and manage them and say "they're doing it". My kids are going to do it, too. They won't have a choice.

I think parents need to really play up the importance of school, and I agree with you that college is absolutely no guarantee of success, although it does help a little I guess.

The world needs unskilled laborers, too, and if kids choose to not do school, they, might choose that kind of career by default.

ID

~~For whatever reason last night my wife was watching the show, and they showed a clip of a guy saying his kids have no opportunities in America because they won't become "rappers", and thats the only way they will get "rich".~~

I just saw a news report over the internet about a poll given to youngsters. If given the choice to be smarter, be famous, be more attractive, or have more money, the kids chose fame overwhelmingly. When they spoke to some of these kids, they say they want to be like the celebrities they see on TV, who have the Escalades and the home theaters and such.


Dr. Guy
~~Perhaps it is the fact that eduction is free that makes them value you ti cheaply. WHile many immigrants see it as a valued commodity.~~

When I read this, it reminded me of a classmate I had several years ago. She had (legally) moved here from Mexico, and I remember her saying how shocked she was at how much kids slacked off in school here, and how much they disrespected teachers.

Jythier
~~If elementary education wasn't free they would complain about it and say they couldn't get ahead because they can't afford it... yet it's free now and the truth is they just don't use it.~~

Good point there.


Locamama

~~I agree that it's a societal thing in the U.S. It seems that many don't want to study hard to have anything. They want to win the lottery, become a rap star or a become a professional athlete even though the odds of any of those things happening are infintesimal.~~

When I have students tell me they want to become NFL stars or famous singers or actors, I don't dissuade them from this dream, but I do inform them of the odds of getting to this level, and do encourage them to always, ALWAYS have a back up plan in case their initial goals don't pan out.

Marcie ~~And if my kid is in school and my kid doesn't learn anything, its the teacher's fault, not my kids. Even if my kid doesn't do his homework or do his work in school, he's there, dammit, and he DESERVES his education, and he should be number one in his class. How does he stack up,~~

I understand your frustration. There are many parents who are really good at teaching their kids to be responsible for their actions, who will push their kids to do the best they can. It is unfortunate that not every parent is like that.


Tova
~~I think Oprah makes a valid point but I certainly don't have any answers on how to make kids appreciate school. Frankly, I don't care if my kids appreciate it. They're doing it.~~


I think the kids that most appreciate school are those who are shown the value of it by their parents. They are shown what they can achieve with a higher education.

But I like what you said, though. Even if a child is not crazy about school, the parent needs to be there to make sure that they get done what needs to be done.

I have a relative whose son does horrible in school because she doesn't discipline him. He stays out when he wants...doesn't do his homework if he doesn't want to. And what does she do about this? Basically nothing...

Greywar ~~Absolutely. if it isn't easy, lucrative, and immediate... they beleive they shouldn't bother trying.~~

This is the age of "Now"...basically everything around them is built to give them immediate gratification--text messaging, IM's, instant downloads, ATMs, etc., etc. It is indeed difficult to get them to slow down enough to see where some hard work can get them.

This is the age of "Now"...basically everything around them is built to give them immediate gratification--text messaging, IM's, instant downloads, ATMs, etc., etc. It is indeed difficult to get them to slow down enough to see where some hard work can get them.

This is very true. But it's up to the adults in their lives to show them the difference and help them to make the difference. It's hard for kids not to want what they see out there or watch on tv. But it's up to the parents to let them know how to get there. Unfortunately not many children have the parents who will show them how, even when there are parents at home.

I don't think that would work Marcie. Kids by definition don't "get" how important school is to their future. My 11 year old is just starting to really grasp the difference between someone who goes to college, and someone who doesn't. (though college is no guarantee of success)

Kids don't get how important school is because it's so readily available. I guarantee you that in the 1800's when kids had to trek a couple miles to school if they were lucky enough to be near enough to attend one, they appreciated it more. It's not as much by definition as it is by culture.

Sure, kids played hookey back then. Sure they would sluff it off when they could. Sloth IS the nature of childhood. But the harder it was for them to attend school, it seems, the harder they worked to succeed.